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A 22-year-old man was shot and killed Monday at this home in Carbondale. The shooting occurred when police responded to a stabbing inside the home. (Andrea Hahn, The Southern)

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Carbondale police shoot, kill man during violent confrontation

by andrea hahn, the southern

Tuesday, January 30, 2007 7:25 AM CST

CARBONDALE - State police have identified Lawrence Wirth, 22, of Carbondale as the man shot and killed by a Carbondale police officer early Monday morning. Wirth was allegedly restraining and stabbing another man when three Carbondale police officers arrived at 305 Beveridge St., responding to a 911 call by a witness about a stabbing in progress, state police said.

One of the officers ordered Wirth to drop the knife. He did not. The officer fired a single shot, which hit Wirth. Police declined to say where the shot hit Wirth.

Wirth was immediately taken to Memorial Hospital of Carbondale, where he was later pronounced dead. An autopsy was scheduled for Monday afternoon.

The stabbing victim also was transported to the Carbondale hospital, and was treated for multiple stab wounds and released. His name has not yet been released by police.

Police Chief Bob Ledbetter said police are well trained in the use of firearms and the appropriate use of deadly force. He referred to the scene as "violent" and the 911 call as "intense."

When asked if the violence was domestic in nature, Ledbetter said the possibility of such a motive was part of the investigation. As a result, he said, specific details were not available yet.

Deputy Chief Calvin Stearns said the department's policy follows the law, and allows the use of force "when it is necessary to prevent death or great bodily harm to the officer or to another person." The department's policy requires administrative leave time for any officer fatally shooting a suspect. Stearns said he could not comment specifically on Monday's shooting.

The state police are leading the investigation of the morning's events. Ledbetter said

"We call them in so the public knows this is a fair and objective investigation," he said.

Several neighbors said they did not hear anything suspicious or out of the ordinary on Sunday night or early Monday morning. Stephen Falcone, who has lived in the neighborhood 25 years, said his mostly collegiate and young neighbors are often "loud and raucous - but not dangerous." He said, though, the neighborhood seems to have turned in recent years, becoming more dangerous.

Ed Tilton, a member of the Delta Sigma Phi fraternity that recently moved into the neighborhood, said he was alarmed to have a serious crime so close to the frat house. He noted that another 22-year-old, Ryan Livingston, was stabbed to death last summer on West Walnut Street just around the corner from the fraternity's new home.

"I think the community has done pretty much everything they can (to make the neighborhood safer)," he said, adding that fraternity members have attended local Neighborhood Watch meetings. "For the police to get here while the stabbing was still going on - they must have gotten here very quickly."

Jackson County Coroner Dr. Thomas Kupferer and State's Attorney Michael Wepsiec are assisting with the investigation, state police said.

andrea.hahn@thesouthern.com

(618) 351-5076

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S wrote on Mar 26, 2007 11:33 AM:

" Most of the questions surrounding Larry's death should be answered Thursday afternoon at the Coroner's Inquest. Like many others who knew and liked him, I was shocked and saddend by his death. He was the last person whom I would have thought would do something like this. From the information that I have now, I think that the officer was justified in shooting him. Unfortunately the Carbondale Police Department doesn't have TASERs or other stun guns. I am told that the officers have asked for them through their union reps but that the City has refused because of liability issues. "

To Concerned wrote on Feb 10, 2007 9:30 AM:

" (its me aha) uh, All im calling for is scrutiny and not give police the atta boy till the investigation was concluded. Im not sure why scrutiny is bad.... i dont live in teh 629 code either... Ive moved to another area of the united states that has sustained economic growth and a police force that welcomes scrutiny and transparency. Im sure you cant relate. :) God luvs yuh and im tryin'! "

lol @ out wrote on Feb 10, 2007 9:10 AM:

" not ignorance at all. But thanks for taking your time to respond to me. (time is more valuable than diamonds or gold!!!!) WOOOOHOOO I DID GET OUT OF SO ILL!!!! dbl woohoo. The point is (many,not all)so ill people think they live in a vaccum. almost all in so ill believe a cop at his/her word. all im saying is that isnt a great idea,(absoloute)when dealing with public servants. whats wrong with exploring all possibilities? that is ignorant? yeah, i got out-wheeeeeeeew! Way to go me!!!! Oh yeah, your so ill name calling reminds me of when i was in elementary school. You go on with your bad seff "

To Gay-ters wrote on Feb 9, 2007 11:40 AM:

" Your comment showed your ignorance. If you don't like southern Illinois, get out. "

Gay-ters wrote on Feb 9, 2007 6:35 AM:

" Just becasue the call didnt go out as a homosexual call, uit would be very naive to think cops in this small-"college town" dont know or arent familiar with residences etc. People on this post and in so ill in general think cops are FLAWLESS, they arent. I also get tired of cops saying, thats why we do it, or poeple hate us....etc. When a cop becoms a cop they know what they will faqce in regards to the public. If you cant stand the heat get your bacon out of the pan.....hahaha bacon "

Face the Facts wrote on Feb 8, 2007 1:33 PM:

" The officer in this case was forced to make the descision to use deadly force in a split second. Most of you posting on this board spent exponentially more time than that simply composing your thoughts here. Despite this, the State Police investigation revealed that he used the appropriate level of force to resolve the situation. Could the officer have chosen another alternative? I am sure he will be asking himself the same question for the rest of his life. Could he have shouted at the suspect to drop the knife one more time?...two more times?....could he have tackled the suspect?....If he did pause for another moment would the suspect have plunged the knife into the heart of his victim? Don't think for a minute that in hindsight the officer hasn't considered all these possibilites over and over. Even with the luxury of time, we all make desisions everyday that we later second guess. The investigation is complete and the evidence shows that the officer was justified in his actions. Fourtunately for him he acted within the scope of his authority. Consider yourselves lucky that you aren't force to make such a descision and then be held up here for public scrutiny. "

Thanks is not common wrote on Feb 6, 2007 4:02 PM:

" As a police officer I have had the opportunity to deal with all types of people. I have learned that people act different in different situations. Meaning that anyone can be kind and nice at any given time, and then been completely out of their mind the next. Everyone has a trigger that can cause this, that is not for the officer to figure out. I will somewhat agree with some of the unpopular opinions posted on here; that is, it is the officers job to find out as much as they can about the situation before acting. But that job is secondary to the safety of the officer, citizens, and even suspects. I am very confident that the officer was not wanting to shoot this person, whom he did not know. We all know what is likely to happen after a shooting;i.e. these postings and opinions. This officer is professional and caring. He, like many officers help people everyday. EVEN THOSE WHO DO NOT LIKE US. But we do this because it is our job and most of us are professionals. For those who don't like the police...WE DON"T CARE. For those of you who truly understand what we go through, THANK YOU. On a seperate note and in response to "More Questions", I am sure the call was not put out as "A homosexual stabbing". So whether or not the cop liked homosexual people, was not even a factor. "

me wrote on Feb 6, 2007 1:08 PM:

" more questions i think you have a good question "

To Just A Reader wrote on Feb 6, 2007 11:21 AM:

" Sexual preference is and was not an issue. The issue was a person trying to cause bodily harm/murder to another person. No one was murdered because the Carbondale police officers responded quickly and took the necessary action to stop the crime. To all others: Please refrain from using the terms liberal or conservative when they have nothing to do with a person's stance on this situation. I consider myself to be a "liberal" but do not believe that the officers involved has a choice under the circumstances. Those who have stated otherwise are not liberal, they are ignorant of the duties of law enforcement and need to stop watching television and join the real world. When told to disarm, a suspect should disarm or face the conseqences. "

The Law wrote on Feb 6, 2007 9:08 AM:

" Wound a suspect and face a lawsuit with a witness. Kill the suspect "CASE CLOSED". Its the law. "

growing tired wrote on Feb 5, 2007 6:33 PM:

" the bleeding heart liberals gracing this board are making me sick. You people watch way too much tv. When faced with a life and death split second decision when one person is stabbing another and you people actually think officers are suppose to aim for an arm or a leg. This is just plain ignorant. Believe it or not shooting someone in the arm or leg, especially if they are hyped up, will NOT, and I repeat will NOT, stop an attack. that is why officers are trained to shoot center mass, not only will this be the most likely way to stop the aggression but also reduces the chances of an errant shot which could hit an actual innocent person. This country is in serious trouble when you people actually believe the bile being spewed here. why dont you people read about real armed encounters and see just how they really go instead of spouting off like you know what you are talking about just because you saw the latest episode of law and order "

just a reader wrote on Feb 5, 2007 3:57 PM:

" Still bad mouthing. I hope that everyone who knows any of these parties involved have stopped reading cause all it does is cause pain. I don't know anyone involved and it hurts me to know that there are those who claim to have hearts yet don't and those who don't have hearts and it shows. There are so many comments on here that just hurt more then help in a situation like this everyone loses not just the one who was murdered. And no matter what was felt for anyone by anyone everyone involved will be effected by this their wholes lives and yes time heals all and all the other sayings but be real put yourself there how would it effect you. Have a heart for those you who don't and for those of you who claim to have a heart for all not just a few. A person's sexual preference should not even be an issue here just because it is not the norm means nothing they are in fact still human and still have a right to be treated as one. "

To Concern Mother wrote on Feb 5, 2007 12:04 PM:

" Yes it would have been nice if the man holding the knife would have been shot non fatally. Since he was in movement stabbing someone we can not be sure the officer was not trying to just wound. After all we know he was told to drop his weapon. What was the officer supposed to do say "hold still just a moment so I can place this shot and de-arm you without hurting you to much." Sorry to say he may have moved and thus done more damage than the officer intended. My prayers to all involved. Ps. to aha: excuses, excuses, sounds like you have a beef with the police. Hope you don't need one badly someday your attitude just might have to change and no I do not live in your area code.. "

kelkel wrote on Feb 5, 2007 12:03 PM:

" I think the officer should not have used deadly force. This was obviously a struggle/fight/stabbing. Shooting the stabber in the arm, leg, knee, butt or anywhere would have stopped him from stabbing- then an arrest could have been made and so on. The stabber was not coming at the officers with the knife and the victim(stabbee) was treated and released the same night. All I'm saying is that it was an out of control situation and the police responded with drastic measures. If I was being stabbed I would want the police to help but I would also want them to analyze the situation correctly. What were th factors here? As in small pocketknife vs. large bowie knife, is victim breathing, fighting back, yelling? For those of you "conservatives" why is it that calling for an investigation into this or basically using any kind of reasoning or putting yourself in others shoes such a difficult task? You should really consult your bibles on this. I believe there is a possiblity something more is going on here and it needs to be investigated. Does conservatism= ignorance and blindness? Do you automatically believe that police always do the right thing? Accepting things at face value is not good business anytime. I just keep wondering WHY the officer was so ready to shoot and kill, instead of stop the attacker and arrest the attacker and help the victim. "

Steve S. wrote on Feb 5, 2007 9:24 AM:

" Lancelot: Think you just may be on to something... "

More questions wrote on Feb 5, 2007 1:50 AM:

" What type of knife was this? Larry was "violently stabbing" this guy for something like five or ten minutes before the police got there, yet the victim was treated and released from the hospital. I'm thinking that this would be a good time to try to get tazers for Carbondale police. One more thing - the officer who shot Larry doesn't have a history of violence towards homosexuals, right? (I have no idea) "

drake wrote on Feb 4, 2007 7:58 PM:

" i want to thank the officer for saving my friends life. i do believe in non lethal ways of doing things but i also now understand that i wasnt there to see the situation. I know it wasnt a lightly made choice and you are suffering too. Thank you "

cj wrote on Feb 4, 2007 7:54 PM:

" thank you just a reader....larry was a great person loving caring and never violent till this point and the victim doesnt have anything to come clean about. this stems back all the way to 2004 when an obsession started after a rejection. it was blown off as him just being upset ...no one could see the future.we all have been to that point in sometime in our lives when we are so sad and distraught over someone it was just taken over the edge this time "

concern mother wrote on Feb 4, 2007 6:29 PM:

" i believe the police did what they had to do ....but couldnt they of shot him where he would still be alived today...i understand if the boy was coming at them...i would be upset if it was my son and i would of ask why didnt u shot him where he wouldnt of die...or bring him down...something ...but there got to be more to the story and isnt being told "

note to aha Ive got it wrote on Feb 4, 2007 2:01 PM:

" It only took a few moments to read your post but some how I feel dumber having read it. Are you really that ignorant or did you have to work at it. Maybe if they had just taken their time getting to the scene then the other person would be dead but at least you wouldnt be blaming the police, oh wait a minute...sure you would. If only we had more bruce willis types on our police departments then they could have knocked out the bad guy with a karate chop. P.S. to Tammy who wrote that the cop should be fired for doing his job, I ask the Southern to ban you from posting so we wont have to read your mindless posts. "

Shoot More, Talk Less! wrote on Feb 4, 2007 9:28 AM:

" Good job, PD! If someone is stabbing me, and you respond, please shoot them first. "

WOW wrote on Feb 3, 2007 5:09 PM:

" It is unfortunate when a person dies, there is no doubt about that. Larry obviously leaves behind many friends and family that will miss him terribly. However they guy brought it upon himself. You do not stab another person if you are a peaceful, kind and gentle person as some of you are trying to make him out to be. He may have been that in his life but he sure as heck wasn't very nice and thoughtful when he was stabbing the other guy, now was he? Kudos to the PO and may God be with him! He is definitely going to face some tough times ahead and it is a shame. "

Local Citizen wrote on Feb 3, 2007 4:48 PM:

" I feel the Carbondale Police deserve our support in this unfortunate incident. The man was told to drop the knife and did not. Those who do not obey authority pay the consequences! We are too lenient in what we allow in our free society. Freedom does not allow anyone to disobey the law or refuse to comply with the directions of a police officer in his or her line of duty. That's my stand. "

who are we? wrote on Feb 3, 2007 2:46 PM:

" Who are we to judge in this situation? why don't you all zip it and spend your time praying...you are all sinners too and are in need of forgiveness I am sure. Why dont we let God judge and stop wasting our time. It was a bad situation PERIOD end of story. God will decide what is to come of it. People are hurting now and your harsh words are not making ANY ones lives any easier. Why dont you work on better yourselves and leave this one alone. Lots of people could use our prayers right now. STOP JUDGING AND PRAY. "

question wrote on Feb 3, 2007 10:39 AM:

" How big was this knife that was used?? pocket knife, or hunting size. Big difference on the type of wounds if you ask me. I mean the victom left the hospital after treatment. Not taking sides till all is clear. "

As the saying goes... wrote on Feb 3, 2007 9:32 AM:

" Nobody likes cops until they need one! A belated thank you to all police officers for the service and protection you provide. "

Its me AHA wrote on Feb 3, 2007 8:01 AM:

" For the record, no one knows if they will come home at night. Indeed no one is promised another second. I am not a cop-however I do work in concert with Police. No weapon no vest, so before you pass your lil so ill judgement on someone understand you could be wrong. I wouldnt be a cop because the only friend a cop has is another cop. Not to mention i cant sustain the machiismo that many cops seem to possess. I said many not all.... Fear has nothing to do with it- Oh yeah i forgot these are so illians and fear is how you all live. Fear change, fear any7thing outside the 629 zip codes....BOO! HAHAHAHAHAHA! Cops arent perfect, so please stop acting as they are. Scrutiny is needed EVERYTIME a cop kills. I will never apologize for that position. "

LANCELOT wrote on Feb 3, 2007 3:50 AM:

" as always the liberals are on the side of the criminal,terrorist,drug dealer,child molester,murderer etc. i have said it before,i will say it again. liberalism is a mental health issue. "

Steve. S. wrote on Feb 2, 2007 8:56 PM:

" T.H.: Guess the poor guy on the bloody end of the knife didn't matter because that's what you are saying. Think you had better sit down and figure out who was the victim here. The one being stabbed is the "human life" I am interested in, "

Kudos to cops wrote on Feb 2, 2007 8:29 PM:

" If you weren't there, you have no right to say it was not justified. You don't know. The officer who fired the shot was forced to do so by the man with the knife. He was told to drop it, and he didn't. Case closed. I feel sorry for the officer and hope he/she can get past this and remain on the job. We need more officers who aren't afraid to take out an obvious threat to society. "

From:aha wrote on Feb 2, 2007 6:22 PM:

" lol @ not bright. do you validate parking too? In all seriousness though, why do so many here think COPS are automatically correct in shooting? (just like there are many that think the cops is automatically wrong.) Intese scrutiny should be welcomed, even invited. To automatically say "heckofva job" is a lil presumptious until the investigation is finished. Anyone agreee? "

Tax Payer wrote on Feb 2, 2007 6:21 PM:

" I am proud to live in a country where we have the freedom to make choices. This man armed with a knife made a choice, to attempt to kill his ex lover. The police came to the victims home, saved his life by shooting the man who was stabbing him. The officers then perform life saving measures on the man they shot. These police officers deserve aa award for there brave actions and for their proffessional demeanor in a very stressfull situation. Also, lets not forget the the Illinois State Police conducted an independent ivestigation that revealed that all officers involved were acting within the law as it given to police officers to protect YOU from the next crazed killer as he stabs you or your son. "

relative of the victim wrote on Feb 2, 2007 6:15 PM:

" i completely understand that the young man shot didn't have to die, but i feel the officer did what he had to do to get him off of my cousin. if it had been me in the victim's shoes, i wouldn't care who was attacking me, i would just want the officer to get them off of me so that i wasn't hurt. this young man was repeatedly stabbing my cousin and, while i am not pleased with the outcome, i thank god that he is alright. for anybody who feels they can pass judgement or whatever, if this had been your relative, all you would've wanted to know was that they were ok. again, my condolences to this young man's family and friends. but frankly, when an officer of the law tells you to drop your weapon, you don't think about it or keep doin' what you're doin', you drop it. they are trained to serve and to protect and that is exactly what these officers did in this particular situation. i love my cousin just the same as that young man's family loved him. it didn't have to end this way, but hopefully this will be a lesson to us all: situations can esculate rather quickly, and in the blink of an eye, things may never be the same again. my prayers go out to larry's family and all that knew him. "

TH wrote on Feb 2, 2007 4:22 PM:

" Can we all just take a step back and realize that no matter what took place...a son, a brother, and friend was lost. Have some compassion for a families loss. "

anon wrote on Feb 2, 2007 4:07 PM:

" I'm usually the first to criticize police officers when they don't do their jobs as they should, but it's clear this officer did exactly what he had to do. "

REALITY CHECK wrote on Feb 2, 2007 3:04 PM:

" I cant believe all this talk about the Carbondale PD. Some of you people sound as if things like this happen every day in this city.Its plain and simple, Man stabs another man with knife,man doesn't put down knife after being ordered to by police, man dies from police gun. What the heck would anyone of us done any different? Talk? ask nice? And maybe Larry was a fine man most of the time but these officers cant go back and and check a persons history to see if he's a swell guy. Things like this are decided in a split second, otherwise the officer would have been going to the hospital. Maybe even had a funeral! "

Just Amazed wrote on Feb 2, 2007 2:36 PM:

" To all you bleeding heart liberials: " If you don't like it, move " I understand you might find your "rights" more protected in some middle eastern countries. Get a life, and the next time you think about, thank a cop for making YOUR everyday world safe!!!! "

tammy wrote on Feb 2, 2007 10:30 AM:

" thank you just a reader... well said "

To Protect & Serve wrote on Feb 2, 2007 10:22 AM:

" When a person becomes a police officer, they take an oath to protect & serve. Need I say anymore? I'm sure that there are situations in this country where police officers use excessive force. We've all seen them on television. However, this is a pretty cut & dry case. Larry chose to do what he did, and then chose to ignore the officer, The officer did what HAD to be done. I'm sure poor little psychopath Larry's family is grieving for him. Had they been more in touch with Larry's life, possibly they might have noticed that he could have benefitted from some counseling. Obviously he had some issues that he needed to deal with. You people that say he was not violent are just as messed up as he is! Would you like to be stabbed numerous times, and an officer sit & watch & do nothing? What if that were your child? It makes me feel good to know that I live in an area where the officers are prepared to do what needs to be done! "

resting assured wrote on Feb 2, 2007 8:44 AM:

" i feel that we are fortunate to live in a society where police officers are well trained and here to protect us. i am married to a law enforcement officer, and i know what he has to be capable of and when. this is not an easy or a lightly made choice for anyone, but we must trust that this officer used his training and observations to make the best choice. it is unfortunate that anyone would be put in a position to make this decision, and then be held up for public inspection. pausing to determine someone's motive is not possible, and could cost other officers or citizens their lives. i am sure this man that was shot was not a bad man, but in a bad situation, almost anyone can lose control. officers only have a few moments to assess such a dangerous situation, and the officer did what he felt he had to do. i commend him for making a very difficult decision, and i commend the police department for standing behind him. and our prayers will be with both the family for their loss, and the officer. "

just a reader wrote on Feb 2, 2007 8:39 AM:

" Do you people actually think this helps the situation at hand? My God both of these were humans both of them had lives and families and if they had been together then their families are bonded in a way and they are all suffering everyone is suffering in this situation and the ones bad mouthing for whatever reason the cop the stabber the stabbie all you are doing is making it harder on everyone involved everyone makes mistakes no one is perfect and everyone touches someones life in one way or another and yes they are just words here but please at a time like this no one on either side needs to be bad mouthed. "

Note:To Aha wrote on Feb 2, 2007 7:49 AM:

" From your comments it is plain you are not very bright! Fear based indeed. It is easy to sit at your computer and judge the situation. An officer goes out every day knowing he might not come home that night. Did he have fear at the scene one may suppose he was afraid for the victim's life otherwise he would not have used his weapon. From your comments I guess you would not have had any fear and like some of these others you would talk this guy out of stabbing another human being with your great wit! Or maybe you are a sharp shooter who could shoot the knife right out of his hand like some of these other bozo's think they could of done. Some of you people need to get real. Yes Larry was probably a nice kid and I am sure his family loved him but HE is the one doing the stabbing with a big KNIFE hello!! Did you read that part? And to the rest of you the officer has a family too, they worry about him every day. They dread their loved one being in this type of situation with such a nice person as Larry wielding a weapon. Bah!! If you think you could do better become an officer and show them how it is really done or are you afraid!! "

Snoopy wrote on Feb 2, 2007 5:59 AM:

" Although it is a sad situation....this man wasn't just smacking someone else around- he had a knife! He had the chance to stop and drop the knife. Maybe he was a good guy, but most people do not take a knife and attack an EX. People have been betrayed, cheated on, beaten, humiliated by an ex and it's horrible... but they do not seek this type of revenge. To blame the officer is absurd...those people just want to blame somebody other than the man who ultimately caused his demise! The officer did what he had to do. BTW, where were all these "friends" if this man was taking the break-up so hard? "

CARAZY Milorad wrote on Feb 1, 2007 10:53 PM:

" You can't be serious in your thinking.If the perp was owed money or was disrespected by the stabbing victim then he had it coming?Isn't that what you are saying?You're nuts.I hope I never disrespect you or borrow money from you or it's akin to signing my own death warrant. "

Amazed wrote on Feb 1, 2007 10:35 PM:

" Officer is found to be to justified in the shooting. Oh by the way, The Victim( that would be the one who was being stabbed)thanked the Officer for saving his life. Libs , go get on someone who deserves it, Not the person who will save your butt some day! "

Police training- wrote on Feb 1, 2007 6:16 PM:

" Just because they are trained doesnt mean they get an automatic justification, (well it really does-but shouldnt) I understand the cop will be effeected etc. But just because this person is a cop and does have training doesnt automatically preclude they will make the right judgement 100 percent of the time....however many here are giving them just that. Everyone makes mistakes even "Trained Cops" So maybe those blaming the cops can ease up and those touting the cops as flawless can ease up and let the investigation take its course. "

TheTruth wrote on Feb 1, 2007 5:33 PM:

" It was two men in a domestic situation after breaking up their homosexual relationship. The officer arrived on scene to find the victim bleeding from a stab wound. The suspect had the bloody knife and was about to stab the victim again. The officer instructed the suspect numerous times to drop the knife. When the suspect failed to follow the officer's instruction, he was put down with a single shot. If he listened to the officer, deadly force would not have been used. The suspect chose not to and now faces the ultimate judge in God. "

T.H. wrote on Feb 1, 2007 4:47 PM:

" Steve S. your utter lack of compassion for a human life disgusts me. So tonight as I pray for Larry's family, I will also keep your troubled soul in mind. "

J.T. wrote on Feb 1, 2007 4:28 PM:

" As another writer mentioned, when a Police Officer is placed harms way and must defend himself or another, He/She is trained to use of deadly force. The Officer is taught to shoot at the largest target (the chest). This offender was hit in the neck. Was the Police Officer going for a head shot? "

Proud resident wrote on Feb 1, 2007 2:25 PM:

" Very Good job carbondale police. If it were up to me, the officer would be given a award. The guy was told to drop the knife and stop, which he didnt. The officer blows him away. Great Job CPD. "

kyle wrote on Feb 1, 2007 1:38 PM:

" For those of you who did not know Larry, you should think before you assume anything about him. I knew him as a laidback, friendly person who was a joy to be around, not a person who was the victim of countless woes of society as some are trying to describe here. He was a good student not known to be a trouble maker at all. Since I wasn't on the scene, its hard to say what reasoning the police officer had to use the force that he/she did. But I also know from years of experience in the Marine Corps that deadly force is not taken lightly. Given the information available, I would have likely responded in the same way if I was presented this situation while on duty. I will miss Larry. He was a joy to have around here in his home community. "

FMofISP wrote on Feb 1, 2007 12:29 PM:

" These are trained professionals, and I know for a fact that the police do not use deadly force unless they deam it absolutely necessary. It is tragic that a life was lost in this situation; however, there is no grounds to say that the officer should be out of a job. I agree I hope that it doesnt happen again either, but I also know that the officer didnt go into the situation thinking to himself, "I'm gonna shoot someone." Grieve for the lost but do not blame the officer who was simply doing his job to protect. "

missing larry wrote on Feb 1, 2007 11:55 AM:

" larry was one of the greatest people i knew. the papers, the rumors, all are making him out to be some crazed killer. they obviously didnt know larry. he was the sweetest,honest,fun and loving person. he will be greatly missed. i hope his parents sue the city of carbondale because of wrongful death. justice would be served if i had anything to do with it. i hope someone gets to the bottom of it because there is a whole lot more to the story than what we read about in the papers. larry i love you! rip. "

Milorad wrote on Feb 1, 2007 11:41 AM:

" I still think it was totally wrong. This guy may have disrespected him or owed him money. The survivor should be questioned about what he did to bring on this stabbing. "

X-C'dale Cop wrote on Feb 1, 2007 11:28 AM:

" For many years I worked the streets of Carbondale and thankfully I never had to use deadly force (only the threat several times). What many of you folks don't understand is the effect this incident will have, not only on the officer who was placed in the situation of making the choice to shoot, but the effect it will have on all of the officers. POs are trained to shoot "center mass" (that's the middle of the chest) and few if any expert marksmen could or would attempt to "wound" an arm or leg. Those of you who believe this officer should be discharged may get your wish because he may quit. What he has been through as a result of the deceased actions is unfair, not only to the deceased's family but to the officer and his family also. Deadly force is not something POs look forward to using and in fact most, if not all, would rather never do so. Those of you who think differently simply don't really know any police officers. "

to concerned: wrote on Feb 1, 2007 11:14 AM:

" I hope that you are never in need of a police officer's assistance. To blame this officer for doing his job is utter nonsense. If the Larry didn't want to die he should not have been stabbing another human. To continue to live all he had to do was put down the knife. My thought and prayers go out to all the officers involved in this incident, especially the one who was FORCED to use deadly force. To those of you condemning the officer(s), you should be ashamed. Like many others have already stated, there is no such thing as "shoot to wound". All of you watch too much television. Turn off the tube and enter the real world. As for Larry's family, sorry if his life ended, but he chose to end it. "

tammy wrote on Feb 1, 2007 11:01 AM:

" i think everyone needs to step back and put yourselves in both parties shoes.there are many people who love both of them and are having a hard time understanding either point of view. a little respect and compassion needs to be given to both sides and prayers for both sides of the situation. "

Mako wrote on Feb 1, 2007 10:17 AM:

" You people are sheep. You think if we just ignore evil and bad things that it is not there that it will not happen. The fact is bad things happen, people do bad things. 95% of crime is premeditated so there is a pretty good chance this guy had thought this out and new exactly what he was doing. Intelligent people do bad things too. It just kills me how so many people are trashing on this officer for holding up what he swore an oath to do. So many people go through life pretending bad things are not there trying to pretend if they don't think about it it wont happen to them. You constantly slam and question everything thing the sheepdog (those who protect us) does. But when it is you that needs help that sheepdog better be here dang quick and he better do whatever he has to to save ME. If that cop would have stood there and tried to talk to the guy or shot him in the arm and the perp ended up killing the victim then we would be hearing a different toon. "String that cop up", "he did not do his job". The cop would be getting sued for everthing he owned by the perp and victims family his life would be destroyed also. He made the only decision he could, he done what he was trained to do.. "

To Tammy: wrote on Feb 1, 2007 9:22 AM:

" Your friend was stabbing the bejesus out of someone and was told numerous times by the police officer to drop his weapon... he did not, so they shot him. Reports have it that your friend was NOT dead before they took him to the hospital, so he was NOT shot with deadly force. He died in the hospital. Saying that he was not a violent person? Um, last time I checked, trying to kill someone with a sharp object by plunging it into a body repeatedly.. IS violent! "

A Liberal wrote on Feb 1, 2007 8:59 AM:

" I have hung out with Larry in the past a couple years ago. Larry did not have a mean bone in him. The fact that this had happened saddens me, but the police did their job the way they though the had to. If he did not drop the knife like he was asked, then the cops had every right to shoot him. I for one will not scream injustice, but the world will be a whole lot emptier without Larry. "

CPD wrote on Feb 1, 2007 7:00 AM:

" The Carbondale Police really need to institute a new policy. Since both guys were 'fighting', one stabbing and the other fighting for his life, I think they both deserved a time out! Perhaps they needed to sit in the corner and not get a snack that day! "

ah-ha! I've got it wrote on Feb 1, 2007 6:16 AM:

" MAY-BE, since there have been several murders to go unsolved cdale pd is trying to put on a winning/PROTECTIVE face for the people. Obviously from the posts here ,there are plenty Cdale residents and others that are primed to jump and cheer for the establishment before knowing everything. Killing in the name of civic morale wouldnt ever be touted as that, but.... In the end we have choices and choices have consequences. Increasingly the so ill police are losing people skills and gaining deadly force. Cops kill when they are scared, and that isnt appropriate. Yet i cant find where a cop has ever been held to account in so ill for unlawful deadly force. CAUSE THEY GOT EACH OTHERS BACK. Not a thin blue line, but a chalky outline. Prayers go out to the family of the deceased. Note to self-Marion/Cdale-Fear based "

anonymous2 wrote on Feb 1, 2007 4:41 AM:

" I don't know who the officer was, but he/she is definitely in my prayers! Along with the other two officers and everyone else that was present when this took place. I am sure it was a horrific scene that will not be forgotten by anyone. I happen to know the story and how officers are trained. I see nothing wrong with any of the actions that were taken that night. Yes, I understand someone who had a family (like most people do) died in this incident, but there was another person in harm's way who was about to die from the first person's actions. I am sure the victim has a family and is a good person, just like everyone says the perp is. I also feel that the situation was violent. I don't think I am going to ask my husband to stab me just because I feel like being stabbed. I am sure the victim, whom I know, did not ask "Larry" to stab him, either. Think about what you people are saying! Think about the families of the victim, police officer, and suspect (along with whomever else was tere) who might be reading these comments at any moment. Keep them in your prayers. "

guy wrote on Jan 31, 2007 11:49 PM:

" Sit back and whine about the use of deadly force by and officer confronting a man, stabbing another. Wound him; in your dreams, Tase him; have you heard the outcry over tasers in university communities. This officer had five options with only one viable choice in a deadly force confrontation;talk,tackle,OC,nightstick,firearm. He doesn't carry a star trek stun gun. You get what you get because you don;t think it is your job to encourage alternative force options. I suggest you take a course, ride along or go be a police officer and attempt to educate yourself in something more than activism. In the meantime, let the cops do their job the way you pay to equipment and train them through your tax dollars. They don't make this stuff up on the run! other than that, I suggest if you hate the cops, you better make friends with the criminals. "

Yo, Tammy! wrote on Jan 31, 2007 10:59 PM:

" People who stab other people do not have "a bright future" ahead. This guy was no model citizen. How stupid can you be?! "

RU Kidding wrote on Jan 31, 2007 9:53 PM:

" Concerned / Tammy You are both out of your minds. I dont care if he was your friend or if he was your brother. I dont care if he has never been violent in the past. HE WAS VIOLENT THE DAY THIS OCCURED AND DID NOT STOP WHEN INSTRUCTED TO DO SO. With that being said the officer only knew the situation at hand. He went into a house were someone was being stabbed the officer only shot him after he asked/told him to stop he did not stop so the officer shot him and yes he killed him. Cops are trained to shoot to kill not shoot to wound. And Tammy deadly force was used I promise you if you were the one being stabbed you would want the person doing the stabbing to be stopped not just wounded most of the time a wounded person just becomes that more mean and aggresive. "

Kat wrote on Jan 31, 2007 9:30 PM:

" The only people who know what really happened in that house are those that were there. The rest of you are just speculating. So much here remains unanswered. Without answers, all your uninformed comments and criticisms are just painful to all those involved (including the officer, the "victim" and the dead man's family). I would guess that most of you don't have a clue who these people are/were nor do you know all the facts. Given that one of the parties involved is dead, all the answers may never be known. Walk a mile in someone else's shoes.....then cast stones. "

Gimme a break wrote on Jan 31, 2007 9:05 PM:

" If the liberal heart bleeders had their way, not one single law enforcement officer in this country would be allowed to carry a weapon. Come on libs! Tell me I'm wrong. "

Laura wrote on Jan 31, 2007 7:57 PM:

" Amen Tammy...I have known Larry since my freshman year of highschool..he was not a bad person and it should have been handled differently! He should not have been shot to kill...there are much better ways to handle it...and to those of you that have no feelings some of us are grieving him so please stop the trash talk about my best friend! thanks! "

dave wrote on Jan 31, 2007 7:17 PM:

" Let me add a couple of thing here to the newest comments; This guy does have family and friends that are grieving for him yes; the person that he was trying to kill also does. If you have a real alternative method that could have been used in this situation that would have worked without ANYONE being killed I'm listening as are the rest of us. Also, to the person who thinks the police officer should be out of a job "so that we will know that it will not happen again"....okay, let's fire him and every police officer that wears a badge... now let's have someone go after you with a knife.....who you gonna call, ghostbusters??? "

Andrew wrote on Jan 31, 2007 7:00 PM:

" ...the silence of the police dept is troubling. "

RE to Milorad and jules wrote on Jan 31, 2007 6:58 PM:

" I thought Milorad was crazy...which she or he is, but...or should i say BUTT HAY??? jules is even crazier.Where in the he@# are these people coming from??? "

USN ETC(SS) wrote on Jan 31, 2007 6:46 PM:

" The definition of deadly force: "That force which a person uses to which he knows, or should know can cause serious bodily harm, or even death. It's use is justified as a means of last resort, when all lesser means have failed." There are also conditions of when to use deadly force. One of them is to prevent loss of life. A knife plunging into someone definitely qualifies. This officer should be commended...and I am sure he will be. "

Kevin wrote on Jan 31, 2007 6:46 PM:

" Steve S. - I suppose anyone who believes in the system of justice is a "bleeding heart" to you. I asked you a simple question - have you conducted your own investigation? One wonders why con-servatives crow on and on so frequently about the "culture of life" when it seems increasingly obvious that they celebrate death as long as it is the result of their superior judgement. And if that doesn't work, they quickly claim to be the official spokesmodels for God. There is an investigation for a reason, unless, of course, you feel it is a waste of taxpayer's money to review the events and the decisions made in an effort to protect the lives of other citizens. "

Amazing wrote on Jan 31, 2007 6:29 PM:

" You bunch of bleeding hearts are even more stupid than I thought. You have no grasp of reality. This situation is a very sad one indeed. A young life was ended that didn't have to be, but the deceased made the decision to not stop when told to. I can't believe that one person even referred to him as "the victim". The victime was saved by the timely response and actions of the responding officers. I'm sure that the officers involved didn't go into this situation hoping for this outcome. When you are making a split second decision of this magnitude there will always be those that want to speculate about what could have been done. I'm certain that the officer that did the shooting probably is doing this more than anyone else and will continue to do so for many years to come. His judgement was sound. His job is to serve and protect and he did just that. The bad judgement was on the part of the deceased young man. The bottom line is that you do not implement deadly force with the intent to merely injure someone. If you do so and the person on the receiving end of this situation should die accidently then you are negligent and are subject to civil action that will no doubt result in your being found guilty of being so, no two ways about it. Deepest sympathy to all involved. "

AMAZED wrote on Jan 31, 2007 6:20 PM:

" Well, it didn't long for the liberals to start on here. Wait a minute, how do you have time to be on here? Don't you have a cheese line or some other Government handout line to get in? "

PD supporter wrote on Jan 31, 2007 6:01 PM:

" Police do not always have an opportunity to shoot someone in the arm or leg. And who's to say that it would have made him stop stabbing the other man? If he was violently stabbing the man, there is no way to get a clear shot through all the movement. If they had moved in to pull him off the other man, one of the officers could have been stabbed. I send my sincere condolences to his family and friends, but in all honesty, the police did what they felt they had to do. It is not our job to second guess or punish them for their decisions on the job. I don't want to be the one being attacked and have the police officers trying to talk to my attacker before helping me. Regardless of the fact that he was not a violent man in the past, he was violent at this moment in time and needed to be treated as such. I assure you that the police officer did not set out to shoot a man that day. It was an unfortunate incident, but it could have been worse for all parties involved. As sad as this man's family may be, there ARE worse things than death- and I speak from experience. "

Observer wrote on Jan 31, 2007 5:15 PM:

" I think that this situation is a terrible tragedy for all involved. I do not cast blame on the CPD officer for his actions, which seem to be the appropriate law enforcement actions. I guess it is just hard for those who knew Larry to hear of the celebratory comments on a "Job well done". I agree with the person that said please remember that he was loved, and he has a grieving family and MANY friends who will miss him. Irrespective of the situation, we knew larry as a wonderful, yet faulted, person...and not as a violent perp who needed to be shot to death. "

concerned wrote on Jan 31, 2007 3:42 PM:

" What is going on here? Two wrongs don't make a right. I feel that the officer who fatally shot this young man should be out a job so that we will know that it will not happen again. "

tammy wrote on Jan 31, 2007 3:22 PM:

" remember he has family and friends who are grieving horribly for him. "

tammy wrote on Jan 31, 2007 3:17 PM:

" He was my friend and i know that he has never been violent in the past. he was a intelligent respectful young man who had a bright future ahead of him. I dont understand why such deadly force was used when there are so many non- lethal options available now.i think this was the wrong way to deal with the situation and do not believe the police should have a right to shoot to kill. "

NotComing wrote on Jan 31, 2007 3:08 PM:

" Al and Jesse will not be coming here. This involves a white guy stabbing a black guy and the cops shot the white guy. So no Al and Jesse in Southern Illinois. "

Kyle Holtgrave wrote on Jan 31, 2007 2:31 PM:

" I'm sad to learn that the police had to kill Larry. I knew him thoughout high school and enjoyed having him involved in the youth ministry program of his home parish in Belleville. He was a friend who I will miss. I, like many of you state, do not know all the facts of the case. As an ex-Marine once stationed at US Embassies overseas as a security guard, I know the "rules of engagement" for using deadly force. And I can say that I would have done the same thing as the officer given the information here. And, as other writers with training in the use of deadly force have stated, there is no such thing as warning shots or firing at less vulnerable areas of the body. Larry was not a violent or otherwise disturbed person that some of you are assuming to be. Larry had hopes and dreams just like everyone of you and those will sadly never come to fruition. I will be with his family later this week to celebrate his life and memory. I pray that we all take a moment to thank the Lord for the time we have and not judge others too rashly. "

Milorad - you can't be serious wrote on Jan 31, 2007 1:48 PM:

" Let it be YOUR mother, father, child, on and on and on be the one being stabbed. Would you still want to know the reason they were being stabbed? You sicken me. "

Weaver Grip wrote on Jan 31, 2007 12:28 PM:

" Well done CPD! I do not relish in the death of a person, but the officer did exactly what had to be done. The suspect was using deadly force on another human being. When he refused to stop, the officer responsed with deadly force. Hollywood pretends shoot to wound is a piece of cake. Manure! When an officer has to used deadly force, his application of that force will, mostlikely, have deadly results. I just hope the officer will see the suspect forced his hand and will realized he had to act to save the stabbing victim. Well done. "

Steve S. wrote on Jan 31, 2007 11:53 AM:

" Oh so sorry Kevin and the rest of you bleeding hearts, what was I thinking? Had you been the victim and I the officer, I would have conducted an on site interview with the perp. Between the 3rd and 5th thrusts, I would have determined that he was abused as a child and that his father beat him and his mama used crack . Between the 5th and 7th thrusts, that the fines, community service and probation he received for his 4 previous felonies and 8 DUI's was much too severe. By the 6th through 12th thrusts, I would have determined that he was truly a product of society's ills and that he had every right to stab your sorry behind as many times as he wanted. I would have put my gun away and walked out. Sure glad you cleared up my thinking for me. "

unknown wrote on Jan 31, 2007 11:53 AM:

" Someone who knows the truth isnt telling. So Ron when are you going to fess up to what really happened. WHen all is said and done you will all know Larry was/is a great person. He may have been wrong for what he did but when will we know the truth. "

unknown wrote on Jan 31, 2007 11:48 AM:

" Nobody knows the true story here. Was Larry really at fault or is Ron going to come clean about all of this?? Sounds like someone knows what really happened. The truth will rise from this. Larry was wrong for what he did yes, but did it have to be this way? "

Hello??? wrote on Jan 31, 2007 11:30 AM:

" Obviously you folks that are talking about shooting the perp in an extremity or asking him why he is stabbing the guy really need some education. Go take some classes at a defensive shooting school and learn why when an officer or person discharges their firearms they shoot to incapacitate the bad guy. Shooting a dedicated adversary in the arm or leg is not going to do anything. If a perp his hopped up on adrenalin or worse (drugs maybe) and you shoot him in the arm all it will do is make him more dedicated and he may really start stabbing the guy or worse come at you and start to stab you. The ignorance of some of you people just boggles me. If someone is stabbing another person they are not just doing it to hurt them a little. They are doing it to kill them. How can you expect someone who has swore an oath to protect the innocent to just stand there and ask questions about why he is stabbing the victim. And after he ignores you and keeps stabbing then shoot him in the arm. Then when that does not stop him then shoot him in the chest. Wow now both are dead and it could have been stopped, but no you had to ask why are you stabbing him? One of the dumbest things I've ever heard. "

tired one wrote on Jan 31, 2007 10:36 AM:

" Kudos for Carbondale police. If a guy pulls a knife on me, I want him shot in the head. You pull a knife or gun on me - you die. Period. "

Amazed wrote on Jan 31, 2007 9:11 AM:

" Some of you actually believe what you see on TV Shows. You don't have a clue what it takes to be an Officer. The last thing we want to happen is to have to shoot someone. Keep the Officer in your prayers and hope the liberal's in Carbondale don't start shouting from the roof tops about the injustice done. "

captspaulding wrote on Jan 31, 2007 8:00 AM:

" I THINK IT WENT TOO FAR! THE C-DALE POLICE SHOULD OF RAN UP TO HIM AND GAVE OUT HUGS AND TOLD HIM THAT STABBING IS BAD AND IF HE DID IT AGAIN HE WOULD BE IN TROUBLE. ALL THIS GUY WAS DOING IS STABBING ANOTHER HUMAN. MAYBE HE WAS JUST STABBING HIM IN THE TOES IM SURE HE WASNT TRYING TO HURT ANYONE.C-DALE POLICE SHOULDNT BE SO VIOLENT. NEXT thing you know YOU WILL BE TRYING TO STOP RAPIST. NEXT TIME SOMEONE WONT DROP THE KNIFE YOU SHOULD TRY SAYING PLEASE THEN IF HE STICKS YOU THEN YOU SAYN SIR IM GOING TO ARREST YOU IF YOU DONT STOP "

Navy GMG (retired) wrote on Jan 31, 2007 6:57 AM:

" The victim and all the officers are alive, based on the information in the article, I think the was handled as well as it could have been given the circumstances. The investigation will tell the tale. When that officer felt the need to protect his and other lives, there was only one way to proceed, immediately stop the actions that were causing the need to shoot. The officer fired one shot, ended the danger, and got treatment for the victim. That is the mans job. The suspect dropping the knife would have ended the situtation. He didn't, here we are. If he had tried to "wound" the suspect and missed, hitting an innocent bystander, say your brother or sister. What would the response be then? I think we have to give law enforcement the benefit of the doubt unless demonstrated otherwise. "

A friend wrote on Jan 31, 2007 6:34 AM:

" I think a tazer would have been a nice "weapon" to have at the time. Not knowing the whole story it is hard to judge anyone's actions. The sad thing is that someone's live has ended. "

annonymous wrote on Jan 31, 2007 12:12 AM:

" Lets all remember there was a person killed in this tragedy. Most of you sound like heartless souls preeching about how the cops were right to shoot him in the chest. It makes me sick. First of all, the whole storyhas not been released yet, and the case is still under investigation. No one leaving comments was actually a witness, so who are you all to judge. Secondly, cops should be trained to "wound" the attacker not kill him. Larry has a family and friends who care very deeply about him. He was still a kid and now he is dead. i think most of you need to re-evaluate your thinking. "

BeReady wrote on Jan 30, 2007 10:56 PM:

" Maybe Al or Jesse will come to Carbondale and set us all straight. "

E wrote on Jan 30, 2007 10:21 PM:

" The victom of the stabbing was treated and released, so his wounds were presumably superficial! The stabber {Larry} was likely a coward, who could not suicide for himself, so he victomizes a honerable officer to be his weapon of choice. A person repeatedly stabbing another? How possibly could the officer hit a rapidly moving target? An arm shot likely would hit the guy being stabbed, or another officer. A body shot stops the stabber, hopefully non-fatally, but stop the stabbing. The guilty party is the guy doing the stabbing, he virtually pulled his own trigger, he just abused the good officer to his own cowardly end! "

Senseless Acts wrote on Jan 30, 2007 9:40 PM:

" I agree that this was a horrible, horrible tragedy. It also sounds like what everyone believes was happening at the time is not the factual occurences of the night. Reguardless, law and policy states that "The decision to resort to force and the degree of force to be used must be based only on fact or what reasonably appears to be fact known to the officer at the time the action is taken. Officers must remain cognizant that a primary law enforcement responsibility is to protect life. An officer shall use only that force that is reasonably necessary to effectively bring an incident under control, while protecting the lives of the officer or another." In other words, all the cop knew was that one person had a knife and another person near him was very bloody. Also, this person refused to cooperate. Therefore, according to policy and law, the officer acted in an appropriate way for the situation. For those who say the officer should have shot to kill, this is also against the law. Officers may use lethal force when they reasonably believe that such force is necessary to protect themselves or others from an immediate threat of serious physical injury or from imminent peril of death. ANY discharge of a firearm is considered lethal force. An officer must shoot to kill; he/she cannot shoot to wound. May God grant peace to all those involved and their families. "

Pro CPD wrote on Jan 30, 2007 9:31 PM:

" Some pretty stupid comments here... If it was YOU getting retrained and stabbed...in pain, bleeding, frightened...I guess a policeman should talk to your attacker and try to figure out his psychology and if you had it coming or not. If someone is stabbing you, they are not doing it to scare you...they are doing it to cause serious injury and or death. Really, REALLY stupid theory. If someone was stabbing your mom, dad, sister, wife, husband....would you wait around to ask questions? "

jules wrote on Jan 30, 2007 8:19 PM:

" I find it interesting that the "Violent stabbing" victim was treated and released and the police shot and killed a 22 year old man. It is my understanding that there were three police officers there. You mean to tell me that they could not restrain the victim and why did they shoot him in the neck? Wouldn't a bullet to the leg of stopped the victim if this account is correct?????? Also, was it reported that the two involved in the case were grade shcool/high school friends, hardly violent murders. Again, if he was stabbed so bad, why did they release him from the hospital? There definitely is something missing from this story. Too bad everyone in Carbondale is quick to jump to conclusions without all the facts!!!! What of the girlfriend that called 911. If it was so "violent" why did it not effect her? The police report is still under investigation and everyone is hailing the city's finest for stopping someone who was a "Violent Criminal" and pity none of it is!!!! Only half the story has been told here. I'm sure the entire truth will never be known because it involves a police officer! Too bad for the people left behind that knew these people. "

Judge Coffee wrote on Jan 30, 2007 8:09 PM:

" To Milorad: I totally agree, maybe an interview could have been conducted and a psychological profile developed. The officer should have also checked the size of his blade with a tape measure to see if it was legal, oh...and where was the background check on this guy...were there any warrants outstanding? MAYBE NEXT TIME IT MIGHT BE YOU WHO ARE STABBED MILORAD! I am sure YOU would want the officer WHO CAN SAVE YOUR MISERABLE LIFE to ask the perpetrator if he has a reason to stab you...while the knife is plunging into your chest again and again! "

Dave wrote on Jan 30, 2007 7:53 PM:

" To the person who mentioned that the officer should have asked why the person was trying to stab the other person first....are you serious?? Think of what you wrote here...put yourself in the position of the perso beig stabbed;would you want the police to prevent your stabbing first or ask what's going on first?? I feel for the officer involved and he will carry this for the rest of his life, but it was the right thing to do. "

policefan wrote on Jan 30, 2007 7:41 PM:

" As a person who grew up in a police family I fully support and understand the office and his decision. A person who is stabbing another individual is not reasonable and is obviously causing bodily harm to another. If the person being stabbed had died the question would be why didnt the office do something. Be thankful the office had the presence of mind to do his job and save a life. "

Former Deputy wrote on Jan 30, 2007 5:25 PM:

" I was a former deputy in a local county. There is no such thing as "shoot to injur". Police are trained to shoot for the central body mass. If I had been the responding officer, I would have done the exact same thing. "

Backin' the Badge wrote on Jan 30, 2007 4:27 PM:

" It should be noted that when a police officer tells you to stop stabbing someone and put the knife down, you should do as you're told. The "shoot-to-wound" comments are rediculous. If you were at the receiving end of the suspect's knife, would you want him shot only in the leg, or would you want him incapacitated so that he's no longer a threat to you? Police officers also know that a knife-wielding suspect can stab you from 21 feet before you can even draw your firearm. Center mass is easier to hit then an arm or leg, and more likely to incapacitate the threat. It's an extremely unfortunate event for all involved, and that means the victim, the officers, the suspect, and the suspect's family. "

ladyfalcon wrote on Jan 30, 2007 3:36 PM:

" I feel sorry for the officer. In a situation this violent I do not believe he had a choice but to use his weapon. For the rest of his life the officer will carry this with him. I am sure in his minds eye he will see a replay of the scene over and over again. Most of these type of police calls only give the officer a second to assess the situation and respond to what is going on. I do know I am glad I am not an officer. I want to say to all the police officers out there thank you for doing a job that most of us could or would not do. I pray that the officer will come out of this situation alright. I do feel sorry for the family of the man that was killed but if he would not of had the knife trying to kill someone he would still be alive and another police officer would not have had to make the decision to use deadly force. "

reality1 wrote on Jan 30, 2007 3:09 PM:

" Unknown needs to expand their knowledge about armed encounters with suspects. This garbage about selectively shooting to wound is TV and Hollywood nonsense. When you put on the badge and gun you know that the day may come that you must draw a weapon and fire-not to wound, but to stop a violent situation from continuing or escalating. No officer works with the thought of looking forward to using deadly force-but it is a reality of the job. Take a moment to think about that officer or about the locomotive engineer that cannot stop the train before it hits a car that ran around a crossing gate. "

Truth wrote on Jan 30, 2007 2:58 PM:

" To unknown the police are trained to het in the chest area, if it comes down to a shoot out the fire there guns to take the other person down for good. Not to wing him in the arm so he can still shoot back. Its real live out there not some bang bang cop movie. "

VH wrote on Jan 30, 2007 2:40 PM:

" As for where did the officer shoot depends on where he was located from the attacker and how the attacker was positioned. The officer more than likely took the only shot he had. It does not matter who it was towards. There are otherways to handle a situation! It may take longer but it avoids deadly force and/or incarceration on your part! That aside. Kudos to the C'dale force. As a wife to a Correctional Officer I agree that we need to bring back more aggressive force towards the perps that would do us harm before during and after they might or will be incarcerated!!!!!! "

bob wrote on Jan 30, 2007 2:34 PM:

" I don't understand why they didn't shoot him in the shoulder or leg preventing death to anyone. There's few spots on the body that one shot kills.. "

Starling wrote on Jan 30, 2007 2:27 PM:

" Outstanding! I have every confidence that the Carbondale PD Officers that were involved had no choice but to respond as they did. This person made the choice for them. The person that was being stabbed survived as a direct result of the Officer's intervention. "Unknown" wrote about "proper training" means not targeting the chest area. Life is not television. The men and women that train to do this type of work for a living are not going to try to shoot the gun from the hand of the bad guy or shoot them in the arm. They are usually trained to shoot until the threat is done being a threat. I say commend this Officer on his/her marksmanship. The Officer fired one shot and hit his/her target There are certain things that are not acceptable in our Society. Stabbing each other is one of those things. "

True Geniuss wrote on Jan 30, 2007 2:23 PM:

" Horay...let's celebrate the killing of another individual!! Oh, and let me guess...you all are self-proclaimed Christians to boot!! Who needs comedians when I've got a population of people like you around me ;-> "

Starling wrote on Jan 30, 2007 2:12 PM:

" Outstanding! I have every confidence that the Carbondale PD Officers that were involved had no choice but to respond as they did. This person made the choice for them. The person that was being stabbed survived as a direct result of the Officer's intervention. There are certain things that are not acceptable in our Society. Stabbing each other is one of those things. "

clint wrote on Jan 30, 2007 2:02 PM:

" I believe its tragic that something like this happend, however given the situation I feel the Cdale police officer acted well within what he was suppose to do and within his training. I'm not defending Lawerence's (Larry's) actions in this matter, what he did was wrong, but he was a very good person and brought a lot of meaning to peoples lives... you should check yourself Steve "

Andrea wrote on Jan 30, 2007 1:24 PM:

" Yes, the police officer probably needed to shoot - but shoot to kill?? Why can't law enforcement shoot knife-wielding persons in the arm or shoulder, somewhere that would stop him from using the knife but not kill him? "

Milorad wrote on Jan 30, 2007 1:11 PM:

" This is totaly unjustified. The police should have asked him first why he was stabbing the other guy. Maybe he had a reason? "

Anonymous wrote on Jan 30, 2007 12:39 PM:

" Why don't you all stop jumping to conclusions before the entire story even comes out....this was someone's son, someone's brother, someone's friend. Wait for the whole story before you judge. "

Watch out wrote on Jan 30, 2007 12:29 PM:

" Be prepared for riots and protests on the C'dale square. All the "do-gooders" and "justice advocates" are going to be coming out of the wood-work. Guess I won't be going to Carbondale for a few weeks. "

Thank You wrote on Jan 30, 2007 12:23 PM:

" If somene was stabbing and cutting me i would want the police to shoot guy right in the middle. Aiming for a leg or arm might miss and give him a second chance to stab and kill me. The cop did rite. I pray that crazys leave him be so that he can keep protect us. "

Kevin M wrote on Jan 30, 2007 12:23 PM:

" How do you know it is a "would-be" murderer, Steve? Have you conducted your own investigation? "

Bravo wrote on Jan 30, 2007 11:01 AM:

" Seems to me the officer had no other choice than to shoot. He had an obligation to protect the victim from further harm. "

unknown wrote on Jan 30, 2007 10:35 AM:

" I think that the news does indeed need to make people aware of whats going on. But at the same time we must focus on where the police shot. If trained properly it should not be towards the chest area. I dont think the situation is fair. But life is not fair. And, I think Ron needs to fess up on who the stabbing was towards. Since he wants to play all tough. "

Steve S. wrote on Jan 30, 2007 10:30 AM:

" Good job Cdale police. There is one would be murderer the taxpayers won't have to feed for the rest of his life. Maybe if this happened a little more often, some of these would be offenders would think twice before using that knife or gun. "

CountDown wrote on Jan 30, 2007 9:41 AM:

" Five, four, three, two, one. Let the second guessing, heart bleeding and protesting begin. "

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